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that's why you are not seeing him read his miranda warnings. he doesn't have to have a lawyer right away. no decision on whether he would be held as an enemy combatant but they want to get as much information as possible, and they are using the government's detainee interrogation group, we are told. so where are we right now? well, the fbi, as we now know, had a request from a foreign government to look into the older brother last year before he travelled -- when he was traveling to russia to look into his activities. there was a belief by that government he might have been involved in some kind of activities. the fbi did look into it. they issued a statement i want to read to you in part saying in response to the 2011 request, the fbi checked data basis looking for things such as derogatory telephone communications, and possible use of online sites associated with the promotion of radical activity, and associations with other persons of interest, and travel history and plans. the fbi did not find anything of concern. and the older brother trav
that's why you are not seeing him read his miranda warnings. he doesn't have to have a lawyer right away. no decision on whether he would be held as an enemy combatant but they want to get as much information as possible, and they are using the government's detainee interrogation group, we are told. so where are we right now? well, the fbi, as we now know, had a request from a foreign government to look into the older brother last year before he travelled -- when he was traveling to russia to...
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Apr 22, 2013
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, remember miranda only excludes the actual statement itself. but if the statements were obtained involuntarily as a result of the sedation, not only can't they use the statements in court, but they can't use any of the fruits of those poison trees. so if they get any leads, they can't use those against this defendant. now, they can use it against others. they can use it for general intelligence gathering. so i agree with jeffrey that they may be making a calculated decision to risk any statements of confessions or intention in order to preserve the greater good of getting realtime intelligence information. >> and public safety which cannot be discounted at this time, that fruit of the poisonous tree so critical in this investigation. alan and jeffrey, standby if you will. we're going to delve a lot deeper into the details in the hour ahead. and also within the past hour a funeral mass concluded for one of the three people who was killed in last week's explosions. there were a lot of mourners packing into st. joseph's church in the boston suburb
, remember miranda only excludes the actual statement itself. but if the statements were obtained involuntarily as a result of the sedation, not only can't they use the statements in court, but they can't use any of the fruits of those poison trees. so if they get any leads, they can't use those against this defendant. now, they can use it against others. they can use it for general intelligence gathering. so i agree with jeffrey that they may be making a calculated decision to risk any...
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so the miranda issue may be not all that important as a legal matter. and the fact that they get information from him that can be used to make sure there are no other conspiracies out there, that may be very useful information. and they can still prosecute him very successfully without those statements because it sure seems like there is going to be a lot of evidence against this guy, independent of any statements he might have made. >> i want to bring in our national security analyst, peter bergen, joining us. peter has written extensively on al qaeda and osama bin laden. peter, i appreciate you joining us. what are the questions that you are most interested in learning about these two, in particular about motivation and their operational capability? >> well, first of all, anderson, i think it's very interesting that they were able to detonate two bombs almost simultaneously. i think that's pretty hard. it suggests either practice in the united states or training elsewhere or perhaps both. we've had terrorists who have gone overseas who have tried to d
so the miranda issue may be not all that important as a legal matter. and the fact that they get information from him that can be used to make sure there are no other conspiracies out there, that may be very useful information. and they can still prosecute him very successfully without those statements because it sure seems like there is going to be a lot of evidence against this guy, independent of any statements he might have made. >> i want to bring in our national security analyst,...
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the united states attorney's office advised us not to administer miranda rights. we gave that information out to our officers and i think all law enforcement was operating under those rules of engagement. >> back to the apartment real quickly. there were devices found in the apartment but you can't comment on what? >> no, i didn't say that. i can't comment on any evidence that was found there. sglp anything that was found in the apartment. are you confident that these two were acting alone and that there are no more suspects out there? >> i'm confident that they were the two major actors in the violence that occurred. i am very, very sure that during this thorough investigation we'll get to the bottom of the whole plot. that's all i can say right now. i told the people of boston that they can rest easily. the two people who were committing these vicious attacks are either dead or in custody. we cleared dozens of packages that had been dropped by people fleeing the scene. so everything was treated suspiciously. in a situation like this, bombers often target first r
the united states attorney's office advised us not to administer miranda rights. we gave that information out to our officers and i think all law enforcement was operating under those rules of engagement. >> back to the apartment real quickly. there were devices found in the apartment but you can't comment on what? >> no, i didn't say that. i can't comment on any evidence that was found there. sglp anything that was found in the apartment. are you confident that these two were...
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certainly he will be read his miranda rights. this is obviously a very controversial subject involving terrorism investigations, but since this was an fbi arrest, this will -- he will be read his miranda rights. he doesn't have to ask for a lawyer. he could make statements that could later be used against him. that's after all what the miranda warnings are. you can have an attorney or you can make a statement. depending on -- >> jeff, let me jump in here. i want to check in with john king. >> -- he will either speak to -- >> john, you're hearing more? >> i just want to pass along information from our producer, who says two federal law enforcement officials have confirmed to her they have verified the identity. it is the younger brother, suspect number two, in custody. it is now they say federal officials verified the identity and have no doubt. as i said earlier, a federal official i communicated with said in custody, unspecified medical needs and they are now sweeping that scene to make sure there are no additional risks. >> bri
certainly he will be read his miranda rights. this is obviously a very controversial subject involving terrorism investigations, but since this was an fbi arrest, this will -- he will be read his miranda rights. he doesn't have to ask for a lawyer. he could make statements that could later be used against him. that's after all what the miranda warnings are. you can have an attorney or you can make a statement. depending on -- >> jeff, let me jump in here. i want to check in with john...
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you're seeing that play out in terms that he wasn't read his miranda rights. the difference being they can ask the question, they can get the information they need. but, the information they get, they can't, then, turn around and use against him at a trial. that would have to be gained separately. >> okay, thank you, chris. chris pulling a late shift for us. it was interesting, he said that, well, dzhokhar will, in fact, be a valuable piece of evidence, if you like. really, he was an older bloer. the younger one, i don't know, went aloong for the ride. >> yeah, the older brother, younger brother scenario. how this is sort of reminiscent of the sniper shooting. it was a similar situation. it soernly was a question just floating out there right now. and now that the police work has played off and chris was talking about tonight, as you've been discussing, it's really time to the legal aspect of the marathon bombings. earlier tonight, anderson cooper talked with senior legal analyst, jeffrey toobin. the first thing that will happen will lay out the basics of the
you're seeing that play out in terms that he wasn't read his miranda rights. the difference being they can ask the question, they can get the information they need. but, the information they get, they can't, then, turn around and use against him at a trial. that would have to be gained separately. >> okay, thank you, chris. chris pulling a late shift for us. it was interesting, he said that, well, dzhokhar will, in fact, be a valuable piece of evidence, if you like. really, he was an...
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Apr 23, 2013
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. >> they can do that at any time even after they read him his miranda rights? >> yes, that's my view. >> so that changes nothing in view of their ability to interrogate? >> what it changes is their ability to question him and use any statement that he makes. that they're not allowed to do. >> he is apparently claiming -- >> they don't need that in this case. they got a mountain of evidence against this guy. >> right. they have testified it seems against him and his brother for the act they perpetrated. >> correct. >> what they will i'm sure be extremely curious to find out if they can is are they part of a wider group of either like-minded individuals who have been coordinating themselves reading stuff on the internet, videos and so on, which apparently is what he's claiming. whether they're attached to anybody in chechnya, for example, or islamic fundamentalist nature, et cetera, et cetera, how far can you go in terms of eliciting that information from somebody like him in his position once he's had his miranda rights read to him as he now has? >> my view is y
. >> they can do that at any time even after they read him his miranda rights? >> yes, that's my view. >> so that changes nothing in view of their ability to interrogate? >> what it changes is their ability to question him and use any statement that he makes. that they're not allowed to do. >> he is apparently claiming -- >> they don't need that in this case. they got a mountain of evidence against this guy. >> right. they have testified it seems...
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don't read him his miranda rights, try him as enemy combatant. seeing this already fall on partisan lines in minutes. >> i spoke with susan collins, a republican senator. >> barely. >> even before the suspect -- >> you're not unhappy about that. >> -- had been captured, she said if this person is in some way an american citizen, i do not believe they should be treated as enemy combatant. >> absolutely. when i said it falls on partisan lines, you'll probably see the rand pauls, the far right come around and defend his rights and vice versa, but this is something that we saw fought over time and time again when george bush was president. ironically, three republican senators or at least the two, mccain and graham were defending the liberal point of view saying don't torture. >> the argument, should the suspect be treated as part of al qaeda and taliban basically. it was authorization for use of force. the question is does it even apply? >> right. >> and will it matter. and then the other question you're going to get to is if we had been warned by t
don't read him his miranda rights, try him as enemy combatant. seeing this already fall on partisan lines in minutes. >> i spoke with susan collins, a republican senator. >> barely. >> even before the suspect -- >> you're not unhappy about that. >> -- had been captured, she said if this person is in some way an american citizen, i do not believe they should be treated as enemy combatant. >> absolutely. when i said it falls on partisan lines, you'll probably...
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. >> so all of that talk of some sort of public safety exception before you give him his miranda rights, all that talk of naming him as an enemy combatant, all of that is moot right now. they've gone forward with the official proceedings. >> well, they may have used the public safety exception, and apparently they were using it to question him, and he responded in some way given his medical condition. but certainly now that he has a lawyer, that period, however long it was, is over. and you're right, the enemy combatant thing was a nonstarter from the never going to happen. this is a criminal case in federal court in massachusetts, and that's where it will stay until it's resolved one way or another. >> it's going to take a while. thanks very much, jeffrey. much more on what's going on in this boston investigation coming up here in "the situation room" 0. >>> also, another terror plot released today, new information. canadian authorities announcing the arrest of two men believed to be part of a terror plot to attack a passenger train that may have been heading towards the united states,
. >> so all of that talk of some sort of public safety exception before you give him his miranda rights, all that talk of naming him as an enemy combatant, all of that is moot right now. they've gone forward with the official proceedings. >> well, they may have used the public safety exception, and apparently they were using it to question him, and he responded in some way given his medical condition. but certainly now that he has a lawyer, that period, however long it was, is over....
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we now that dzhokhar, suspect number two, has been read his miranda rights. sow won't be designated as an enemy combatant. but if he was labelled an enemy combatant, he wouldn't have been entitled to a lawyer and a jury trial. they could have asked him a lot of other questions without a lawyer present that may or may not be relevant to national security. now why did they make this decision not to go for enemy combatant status? do they think they have so much evidence in this case that they can go ahead with the civilian jury trial and they don't need to hide behind enemy combatant? >> i think that is certainly part of it. it does look like an overwhelming body of evidence. more than that, they thought they could get the immediate information they needed by the miranda exception, the public safety exception so they could make sure the public was safe. there accident seem to be an constitution aal basis to treat someone that commits a crime like this on our soil. the supreme court has upheld treating an american, the american taliban hamdi captured in afghanist
we now that dzhokhar, suspect number two, has been read his miranda rights. sow won't be designated as an enemy combatant. but if he was labelled an enemy combatant, he wouldn't have been entitled to a lawyer and a jury trial. they could have asked him a lot of other questions without a lawyer present that may or may not be relevant to national security. now why did they make this decision not to go for enemy combatant status? do they think they have so much evidence in this case that they can...
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why does the miranda issue matter? >> it really matters on whether there will be able to determine if there is other further threats and whether there will be able to prosecute him in federal court. and as soon as they mirandize him and give him the right to a lawyer, they know they can use those statements against him in court. if they don't do that, they will have a very tough time using any evidence they collect from him before that time against him in a federal courtroom. >> put yourself in the shoes of the obama administration. they want to know as much as they can about how this happened so as to not make -- make sure it doesn't happen again. if he lawyers up, if he is read his miranda rights, he probably will be advised not to cooperate and not to say anything. isn't it just to play devil's advocate in the best interests of the nation to withhold on doing that for a second and gets a much information as they can? >> well, it's a very tough decision, but really the exception they're using is the public safety exc
why does the miranda issue matter? >> it really matters on whether there will be able to determine if there is other further threats and whether there will be able to prosecute him in federal court. and as soon as they mirandize him and give him the right to a lawyer, they know they can use those statements against him in court. if they don't do that, they will have a very tough time using any evidence they collect from him before that time against him in a federal courtroom. >> put...
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let's talk about miranda here and the fact that his rights have not been read to him. what do you make of that? will that be an issue going forward in this particular case? >> you know, it depends. first, i don't know -- we don't know if he's said anything. if he hasn't made any statements at all, the fact that he didn't get his miranda rights read is not going to be an a relevant issue. if he's made statements i think what the government is doing in expanding that public safety exception beyond the immediacy of the act i think is something that will be taken up, and it will have to be looked at maybe by the u.s. supreme court who just last week heard oral argument in the case from houston that was asking the question when does the fifth amendment or when does your right to remain silent gyp, and so we're already looking at these issues. this is an expansion i think that expands the public safety exception. i think some court is going to have to look at that. >> thank you very much. it's been almost a week now since this city was terrorized, and it's seemingly been one
let's talk about miranda here and the fact that his rights have not been read to him. what do you make of that? will that be an issue going forward in this particular case? >> you know, it depends. first, i don't know -- we don't know if he's said anything. if he hasn't made any statements at all, the fact that he didn't get his miranda rights read is not going to be an a relevant issue. if he's made statements i think what the government is doing in expanding that public safety exception...
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the argument i guess is under this limited questioning period before he is formally advised of his miranda rights, he has and right to an attorney, doesn't have to answer any questions. there has been some suggestion that can only last maybe 48 hours or so if he's formally named an enemy combatant, that would go on for days if not weeks. i guess that's the distinction. >> it's the length of time. right. the enemy combatant, if that designation were made, could go on for weeks or even months. but i just think it's important to emphasize that the obama administration has absolutely not considered that, has not considered that approach, and every terrorism suspect under either the george w. bush administration or the obama administration who was arrested on american soil has been treated as a criminal defendant in the united states courts. senator graham's proposal would an complete departure from that approach and i don't think there's any indication that's going to happen.that approach a there's any indication that's going to happen. >> and he's a naturalized u.s. citizen. only 19. but last
the argument i guess is under this limited questioning period before he is formally advised of his miranda rights, he has and right to an attorney, doesn't have to answer any questions. there has been some suggestion that can only last maybe 48 hours or so if he's formally named an enemy combatant, that would go on for days if not weeks. i guess that's the distinction. >> it's the length of time. right. the enemy combatant, if that designation were made, could go on for weeks or even...
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all of this is moot right now, because as you know, yesterday, he was formally given his miranda rights and a judge magistrate at his bed side with a court-appointed attorney, a public defender. this is moot as the obama administration has made its decision. is lindsey graham on sound legal ground, saying he should be tried in a civilian court, but held and questioned as an enemy combatant? >> i think the only fair answer to that question is we don't know. because it's never been done before in american history to have some sort of hybrid combatant and criminal proceeding. we do know from jake tapper's reporting, there was an interrogation of tsavraev. and he did disclose his position that there was no broader conspiracy here. just him and his pressure. it seems like the justice department and the fbi have done the kind of interrogation that at least -- that lindsey graham seems to want to have been done, perhaps not as extensive as it might have been. but there was a premiranda interrogation and authorities can work with that, at least now going forward. >> i think that's a fair point.
all of this is moot right now, because as you know, yesterday, he was formally given his miranda rights and a judge magistrate at his bed side with a court-appointed attorney, a public defender. this is moot as the obama administration has made its decision. is lindsey graham on sound legal ground, saying he should be tried in a civilian court, but held and questioned as an enemy combatant? >> i think the only fair answer to that question is we don't know. because it's never been done...
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he's been given his miranda warnings and probably anything he said without his miranda warnings is not going to be needed by the government or the prosecution. remember, they did not indict him as a terrorist, that's very important. they indicted him as an ordinary murderer, anybody who wants to kill their mother-in-law, business partner and makes an improvised explosive device and kills them is just as guilty under the statute indicted as osama bin laden might be. this is not a terrorist prosecution. they don't have to prove intent to terrorize, intent to intimidate. they can prove their case just through the videotapes. now, i predict there are going to be two types of possible defenses in this case. number one, the jihad defense. i did it, i'm proud, i'm happy, please kill me, i want to join my brother in paradise. i'm a martyr. the other, my brother made me do it, i am innocent, look at my face, look at my high school record, i really didn't mean it, don't give me the death penalty. i think from what we have heard now, the jihad defense seems like it is off the table. he is prepare
he's been given his miranda warnings and probably anything he said without his miranda warnings is not going to be needed by the government or the prosecution. remember, they did not indict him as a terrorist, that's very important. they indicted him as an ordinary murderer, anybody who wants to kill their mother-in-law, business partner and makes an improvised explosive device and kills them is just as guilty under the statute indicted as osama bin laden might be. this is not a terrorist...
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from dzhokhar tsarnaev to investigators, we do not know if that was before or after he received his miranda warnings or before or after he obtained counsel. that's an excellent point. one of the things we do know that he is saying apparently is that it was his brother tamerlan who was the mastermind here. is that something that could be helpful to his defense if he was merely following his brother? >> well, it will be helpful to his defense in the sense of mitigating the penalty that he might end up suffering. from what i've read and what i've seen, he's clearly as culpable as his brother. the videos that they picked up, and the statements that he made to the driver of the suv, all would indicate that he was a willing participant in this crime, and also the fact that he fled from the scene would further indicate his willingness to participate in this crime. however, any influence that he might have suffered from his brother, his brother's influence on him, may again go to mitigate any penalty that might be imposed upon him. whether he ends up getting the death penalty or whether he ends up
from dzhokhar tsarnaev to investigators, we do not know if that was before or after he received his miranda warnings or before or after he obtained counsel. that's an excellent point. one of the things we do know that he is saying apparently is that it was his brother tamerlan who was the mastermind here. is that something that could be helpful to his defense if he was merely following his brother? >> well, it will be helpful to his defense in the sense of mitigating the penalty that he...
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as you know there was a public safety exemption before he was read his miranda rights. so there was time when law enforcement had the opportunity to talk to him before he had quote/unquote lawyered up. but we don't know yet whether or not this information came before he said he understood his rights, or after. >> all right, jake tapper, terrific reporting. great to have you here this morning. >> thanks, john. >> don't miss "the lead" every day at 4:00. we're also learning more this morning about -- we're learning more this morning about criminal complaints against tsarnaev detailing step by step how the deadly attack on the boston marathon unfolded. our coverage continues this morning with miguel marquez outside best israel deaconess medical center right here in boston. good morning, miguel. >> good morning, john. this is the criminal complaint that contains what we expect are the first charges. we'll see many more against mr. tsarnaev. in the criminal complaint, investigators built a minute by minute account of the tsarnaev brothers as they moved the crowds at the mara
as you know there was a public safety exemption before he was read his miranda rights. so there was time when law enforcement had the opportunity to talk to him before he had quote/unquote lawyered up. but we don't know yet whether or not this information came before he said he understood his rights, or after. >> all right, jake tapper, terrific reporting. great to have you here this morning. >> thanks, john. >> don't miss "the lead" every day at 4:00. we're also...
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establish who is going to handle these crimes but there is no need to rush over here and read any kind of miranda rights or arraignment for a local crime here at this hospital because that young man is not going anywhere and there is no federal statute of limitations or state statute of limitations with regard to murder. they have all the time in the world they want if they want to prosecute him for any kind of murder in the neighboring county, wolf. >> and security is very, very tight over there at the beth israel deaconess medical center. ashleigh, thanks very much. >>> coming up, he is only a couple doors down from one of the bombing sites and he took in victims just after the blasts occurred. ahead, my interview with a restaurant manager struggling to get his business back up and running. >>> plus, a dancer wounded in the blast now faced with the challenge of dancing without her left foot. >> i have moments where i just throw water bottles across the room and throw my walker and get angry and mad that someone did this to me. [ indistinct shouting ] ♪ [ indistinct shouting ] [ male announcer
establish who is going to handle these crimes but there is no need to rush over here and read any kind of miranda rights or arraignment for a local crime here at this hospital because that young man is not going anywhere and there is no federal statute of limitations or state statute of limitations with regard to murder. they have all the time in the world they want if they want to prosecute him for any kind of murder in the neighboring county, wolf. >> and security is very, very tight...
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just to confirm, this -- dzhokhar tsarnaev has not yet been read his miranda rights, correct? >> i have to say i don't know. because there was an initial appearance today, that's why this complaint is out. the circuit executive, the administrator of this area, has put out a statement saying there was an initial appearance before a magistrate judge. that is as far as i understand it an arraignment. i have never heard of an arraignment without an attorney present. they didn't mention an attorney present. if an attorney is present, the attorney will simply say to the client, you -- don't answer questions. at that point, the attorney is the person the prosecutor is supposed to deal with. i have to say, there is information out there that we don't have. whether an attorney was present, whether this was an actual arraignment, i think we just need to hold off on that until we get more information. >> we're holding off. still so early this all happened. >> before we let deb feyerick go and chase down that lead she was referring to, deb, i was wondering, is there anything else that sta
just to confirm, this -- dzhokhar tsarnaev has not yet been read his miranda rights, correct? >> i have to say i don't know. because there was an initial appearance today, that's why this complaint is out. the circuit executive, the administrator of this area, has put out a statement saying there was an initial appearance before a magistrate judge. that is as far as i understand it an arraignment. i have never heard of an arraignment without an attorney present. they didn't mention an...